00:00.20 archpodnet Welcome back to the Archeot Tech Podcast episode 211 and let's shift gears a little bit so you mentioned Che and itsa what have you guys been doing over in checha ita because Chi and ita is one of those places that I feel like. Just about everyone's heard of like the pyramids of Giza or something like that. You know what I mean like even even people who have never been down there which I have it. My wife has actually been there. Um, but it sounds like 1 of those places. Everybody's known about so what? what new research is being done what on what and an unanswered questions. Are you guys looking at in that area. 00:33.13 Denisse Argote Well after the 2014 and 2015 discovery that we made with the art team and we have you working also with archeological materials. The structures moral paintings with portable every fluorescence. 00:43.80 archpodnet Um. 00:52.23 Denisse Argote And I the former two years in the last two years we made another project. We are working another another project. You've seen radar to analyze all the all the plaza. 01:04.95 archpodnet Um. 01:10.76 Denisse Argote I mean you said you haven't been there but there is a really big pla. Ah that is around the kukulcan temple is around ten Thousand Square kilometers so it took us around ten days 01:19.52 Paul M. 01:23.23 archpodnet Well. 01:30.25 Denisse Argote Working sun to sun that was really hard because it's really hot in there. but yeah but I mean ten days working to sweep all the plaza and the ball game. 01:35.28 archpodnet Oh yeah. 01:48.21 Denisse Argote To see what's beneath you know chichenisa also have several construction stages chi chenisa is a site that were built around six six hundred and fifty before after christ. 01:51.99 archpodnet Um. 02:07.49 Denisse Argote And was abandoned around me maybe ten thing Eleven Eleven hundred after Christ so it has around 500 years of settlements. 02:17.55 archpodnet Okay. 02:17.67 Paul Mean. 02:25.97 archpodnet Right. 02:27.44 Denisse Argote So the last one that on the one that we can see currently is the last stage but there is a five hundred year history beneath this plaza. You know so and we car to. 02:42.32 archpodnet Ah. 02:47.32 Denisse Argote Use raider to see what's been needed and we found 2 previous stages of the construction of this plaza. It was really small in the beginning and grew over time to get the size that we can now see. So it's it's so so interesting because it tells you about the history of this settlement. 03:12.11 archpodnet Did the just a little bit about Che Chi Needsza here did the function of Chee Chi Needsza change through time. Can you tell that in the archeological record. 03:23.17 Denisse Argote Well in in the beginning. It was also a ceremonial ah ceremonial site at least in the the center part but it was also um, high run settlement. 03:33.96 archpodnet Um. 03:38.28 Denisse Argote There were several palaces in what we know as the old TiIta that is south of the site like 2 kilore south of the cokul camp pyramid. So there were also several colonies. Oh. 03:41.95 archpodnet Okay. 03:48.24 Paul This. 03:57.69 Denisse Argote Small areas that were occupied by different rulers is it's a very complex city because you have ah a very cosmopolitan area with people coming from sabers as sites of the the maid area. It has the people. It had people from oshmael people from my Japan people from the center of Mexico that were communicating and interlating with them cnisa people is is very complex. It's very similar to Titiwa can. You know Juan is also very cosmopolitan city that kind ah that welcome people from all around the the miss american area in this case, Chiennia also had the influence of several cultures central Mexico cultures and mag and cultures. 04:35.33 archpodnet Ah. 04:54.34 Denisse Argote So this gave ah this this bloom of the of the culture of the Chichanisa culture. 05:02.95 archpodnet Um, okay, wow and you guys ah when when did you guys work out there last remind me. 05:10.79 Denisse Argote The last time we went is was' in May hi I am preparing the report of the the last found things we made still working on the report I mean because you I mean it is hard work to go to the field. 05:15.44 archpodnet Okay. 05:23.50 archpodnet Um, yeah. 05:29.31 Denisse Argote And make a perspective but it's a lot longer to process the data to make sense of it to try and apply different filters to enhance the features the pictures that you are finding. And then to write a report that makes sense to other people that do not manage its kind of information ah or techniques. So It's It's a long, a long project long work. 05:51.48 archpodnet M. 05:52.42 Paul Moving. 06:00.00 archpodnet Yeah I know you're still in the process of writing the report but is it or anything you can disclose that were some insights or revelations based on the research you guys did. 06:00.15 Paul Ah. 06:11.41 Denisse Argote Well in the case of the ball game. We know that it extended longer that it seems that is currently seen. We also find a small structure near the the ball game inside the plaza. But. Almost in front of the ballgame that you cannot see actually or currently we also find 2 stages of the construction of the plaza and we believe that we might found near the pyramid. 06:35.35 archpodnet Um. 06:42.31 archpodnet Um. 06:47.73 Denisse Argote Near the theircases some areas with some burreals but we don't know that their human remains or maybe just some gift for the guts. So I mean. 06:59.85 Paul E. 07:00.57 archpodnet Okay, all right. 07:05.97 Denisse Argote There's still a lot to work with but these are some things that were not that we cannot see just by working around the area. 07:13.36 archpodnet Right? Yeah and I will go ahead. Paul no ahead. Okay I I was going to redirect as well. Go ahead. 07:15.99 Paul Ah, of course so you've go ahead. No no, you take it? Seriously, you have a follow up I've got a redirection. 07:32.53 Paul Okay, so Denise ah you you're obviously working all over Mexico and have worked all over Mexico on a variety of different sites. Um with a variety of different geophysical techniques. Um, is there something new of new project that you haven't yet started or maybe some new technique that you're hoping to. To test out sometime in the near future. 07:51.54 Denisse Argote Where we're trying to deal the laugh in in the area of teaching. It's ah it's still a project that's going on but we want to implement several technologiess do the archeological study. That is maybe x-ray deraction rayemond like Lisa Raymond I know you you know? Raymond's spectrometry is so is well is a laser that is beam to some artifacts or even walls or any solid material. 08:16.80 archpodnet M. 08:16.52 Paul I know I'm not familiar with it. 08:28.94 Denisse Argote And it can give you this ah mineral that compose this this sample for example, in the case of pigments red pigments. You know the common pigments that the minerals that were used to made red pigments are. 08:33.10 Paul M. 08:35.40 archpodnet We go. 08:46.56 Denisse Argote And iron oxides and cnavare if you just see them. You might not discriminate which was or even in the iron oxides you have several minerals go at it em limolite and some other minerals and you cannot see. 08:49.41 archpodnet Right. 09:06.45 Denisse Argote You cannot know which of these minerals are the one that they were using so Raymond or Raymond yeah spectrometry tells you the precise mineral that was used to to make this pigment. So that is also very good information and there are 2 2 instruments the one that you have in a lab and the one that you can take to the sites. So. It's also nondestructive it says really really important now in in current. Archaeological investigations. 09:44.77 archpodnet That sounds very similar to xrf how does it differ from ah from like the portable xrf or do you just walking out there with a holster with 1 laser on one side and 1 on the other side and just shooting everything. Ah. 09:44.92 Paul Um. 09:51.48 Denisse Argote Yeah, yeah, that's that's it. Well there are complementary techniques because xaray every floesence tells you the composition. It will tell you you have iron run. You have? um, maybe so for or the elements but you don't know the mineral in Raymond tells you the mineral doesn't tells you the composition. It tells you the mineral. 10:19.62 Paul Ah. 10:20.20 archpodnet Um, okay. 10:27.91 archpodnet Okay, that's interesting. Yeah. 10:30.41 Denisse Argote So they are complementary I mean it with fluoresences I cant tell you these red pigment was made of iron oxides. But I cannot tell you if it was emmate limolet coat teeth or any other mineral. 10:48.18 archpodnet Okay. 10:49.88 Denisse Argote You know Raymond or even an aray refraction can't tell you that information so they are complementary. 10:51.54 Paul Um. 10:59.41 archpodnet Okay, wow, that's cool. Yeah I don't think I'd ever heard of that one that's ptrometry I have to find some information about that. Um all right? Well we are just about done for today. What? Ah, what do you guys have. 11:01.27 Denisse Argote Cut. 11:14.36 archpodnet Coming up on the horizon here. What's what's your next field season look like. 11:18.57 Denisse Argote Bc as always, but that is good I mean ah we have ah in the state of chapas there is a project to find the remains of an. 11:21.73 archpodnet Ah, good. Ah. 11:31.42 Denisse Argote All general that came a colombian general that came to Mexico and established in chapas but the colombian and government wants to find him because he is a hero in that country but they do not know where is the boreal place of. Remains. So we are gonna try to find them That's a project for for next year we also have going ah the mitla area project. Also the chiennia project we are trying to make leader ah leaderter flights. 12:07.00 Paul M. 12:09.83 Denisse Argote To map all the but the tropical area you know it's really difficult to walk around in these environments So leader image called Tell us a lot of how is the distribution of this. 12:15.14 Paul This is. 12:28.90 Denisse Argote City without having to walk around all this jungle area so these are 2 projects that are going to be running next year and there's. 12:33.16 Paul M. 12:37.60 archpodnet Ah. 12:43.22 Denisse Argote Always new projects. There is always new new people that come to us and ask us our help analyzing statistically a processing that that ah and making an analysis I am also working on a. Raw Paintings Rupetra I don't know how you said all these prestoric paintings that are made in Capes. We are also making some analysis in in Cavees to see the pigments. 13:07.89 archpodnet Okay. 13:19.13 Denisse Argote Determining the raw materials of these prehistoric paintings. It's also a project that's going on on I don't know if there's always new Any objectives New you probably used to work with. 13:22.29 archpodnet Um, yeah. 13:32.69 archpodnet All right? Well sounds like you're keeping busy anyway. 13:36.00 Denisse Argote Yeah I'm more busy that I will like to but it's fun. 13:42.21 Paul Ah, well thank you despite your busy Satch to take some time to talk to us about this. It's been really fascinating to me. 13:43.91 archpodnet Ah, nice. 13:50.72 Denisse Argote Nana is really great to talk to you guys. So thanks you for the invitation and I hope to maybe be here some other time. 13:59.17 archpodnet Absolutely yeah, exactly. So if you or if anybody else listening ever wants to come on the show talk about any projects you're working on and just have a conversation with Paul and I then hit us up at Chris at archeologypodcastnetwork.com or you can find contact information on the show notes. 14:00.20 Paul Um, great doors are open. 14:18.54 archpodnet Or the webpage arkpodnet.com all right with that. Thanks Paul and especially thanks Denise for coming on the show. 14:23.87 Denisse Argote Thank you guys.