00:00.00 Cornpop Welcome back to episode one zero eight of a life insuranceance podcast we are here with Dr Carlton shieldll chief gover and Conor Johnn um no guests just us no shoes. Um, so Devin Pedigre Dr. Devin Pedigre he's been on the show a few times we're gonna have mine again here soon. Brilliant dude. Like hast the absurd knowledge of atlatl at at lot hillery at Laty. Um, was like hey we're going to do an experiment. Ah do you and Connor want to come Carlton's coming I was like yeah sure and he gave me a Gps coordinate up in the mountains and he was like yeah just park here. It's on the side of road and it's like a short hike up to this hill. Like alright cool I didn't pack cold clothing nor did I pack any hiking shoes I need you just pack hiking shoes when I go out west I just it's a thing I gotta do now but not only was this not a short hike. It was like the steepest hill I've been on in a while and like we didn't know where you were. Because like it was too far to like call for you and Lana was like they went up that way so like I just followed a game trail and eventually like 1 of us shouted and we heard you guys and we got out there and I was just like and like lana stopped it like took a puff p of her like vape that's like how are you doing. And we finally all got up there. We get to the top and I had to like lay down for a bit because I was just like oh my god I cannot do altitude anymore and Devyn's up there just hammer it away make it up the targets and stuff like that. Ah, and we start setting up for this atlaal experiment which we'll get into um but to my surprise I'm standing there just talking with them. Getting my camera stuff ready donny dust just shows up out of the woods ah hit up the hill without even like having breaking a sweat nor was he panting and he's like what's up guys. He came right up and just threw shit down and gives Carl did a hug and he's a doctor is like the most. 01:44.10 mr_ sad Ah. 01:51.38 archpodnet Oh my god that pat on the back almost made me throw up. He is so strong that it just bear hugs you and it like hurts and like I don't as I'm a big guy to and I usually don't get hurt but like I'm terrified of like Donny dots hugging me because there's just so much man in there. 01:55.10 Cornpop Bizarre experience is. 02:07.72 Cornpop Um, yeah. 02:09.30 mr_ sad I Feel like that feel like that's the only way he can make an entrance though you know if he showed up like in a car and just like walked out like it just wouldn't feel the same like I want him to be like stock up against me and like you know, put a knife to my neck and be like caught you. 02:13.18 archpodnet Yeah, yeah. Yeah. 02:26.14 Cornpop I mean the kids a former marine. So yeah, may good have. But ah yeah, he was up there because ah debit so a paper came out. We'll talk about this when Devin's on here saying that for the the 1 sentence thing is saying that clovis people couldn't have been hunting mammoths with clovis points or at lattles which is just. 02:28.77 mr_ sad Me. 02:29.11 archpodnet There. 02:45.75 Cornpop Total andcomplete bullshit cause like we've seen it happen or not like a live mammoth but like we've seen them go into an elephant before and you guys have thrown them through a bison in which we've seen. Ah that's on Youtube currently, um, anyway, so we was there to do that and of course ah like I'm a lot out littletle dude Connor's thrown them before. 02:54.11 archpodnet There. 03:05.33 archpodnet Yeah. 03:05.42 Cornpop Carlton's obviously you're pretty good at it. Dude um and he had 3 of us up there and Donny throwing them to test velocities. Um, and yeah, it was pretty cool. 03:11.39 archpodnet Yeah, yeah. 03:12.79 mr_ sad Also said we also had chance and another ph d student Mike Crate Tom Tom dumb 03:17.49 Cornpop Ah, yeah, could remember their name. 03:17.83 archpodnet Ah, um, oh Tom. So yeah, there is so Devin's thing Donny me Lana Phil Youtube and then chance and chance and Tom and so the point of it as as David said there a paper came out that basically said there's no way. Clovis tipped clovis point and tipped out lals could have killed mammoths and the way they did this was by firing clovis arrows off a £35 bow into clay and like there's so many problems with that. It's like you can't fire like modern day bows. Are meant to fire modern day arrows with arrowheads from 100 to 300 grains like that is what they are designed to do you throw anything larger than that on there. It's going to absolutely destroy the ballistics because those arrows in bows are designed. 04:00.14 Cornpop A. 04:11.80 archpodnet To fire much smaller broadheads like it's a whole issue like and we see this you know archeologically we know darts varied in shape size and length and also you know a bow isn't the mechanics of a bow are not necessarily analogous to the mechanics of throwing an out lot of dart and so what Devin wanted to bring us up there for. 04:23.75 Cornpop No. 04:30.39 archpodnet With all the different cameras in the backdrop was we all threw different weighted at Latl darts. Um at a target and we're just trying to measure the velocity so we can get the joules off of it and basically get some preliminary data data to show oh dad da add Atl da. 04:43.13 Cornpop Um, daddle at lattle thattle. 04:48.99 archpodnet And lot of data. Um, ah to show that indeed. Yes, you can actually get these things moving out of speed and in in a previous experiments. We had already shown that so in the bison experiment that we have a Youtube video on that probably should get redone at some point. Um we I'll have data already showing that we can throw some of those darts. With over like four hundred joules of energy. Um, we told that to Don and he's like I don't know what a jewel is but awesome science and it's just like so we're hoping to get a paper out of it and just to be like no actually you can and that's one of those things like we've talked about and I'm sure you know Dr Servell and his. Ah. Episode last time you know the whole overkill hypothesis is like fundamentally rooted on the fact that people could use clovis tip atlatls to you know murder hobo their way across the world. 05:37.49 Cornpop Yeah, um, yeah, that episode. Well I guess when this is out ah have already been out it so previous episode if you have it listened to it. Um, but yeah, it was fun and like and like I was taking pictures and stuff for the paper. And like different angles of the experiment and stuff and like at 1 point Connor was like why don't you come over here by the target and get some good shots and I was like I shouldn't get that close to you know what? it's Donny dust if there's anybody I trust to hit this target with a hat ladtle. It's Donny dust and I'll stand right next to it and I got some 6 shots. 06:10.43 archpodnet I yeah. 06:12.56 mr_ sad I'm really disappointed. You didn't you didn't bring up what I actually said is like I know this is going to sound sexual. But do you want to come over here and get some penetration photos. 06:18.13 Cornpop Um, all right? That's right? yeah. 06:21.63 archpodnet Yeah, that was that was you had everyone dying and also this is like right after the whole weekend of festivities like everyone was like trying to recover. Yeah, it wasn't. 06:29.45 Cornpop Us is not alive. 06:31.27 mr_ sad Yeah I was I was going to say it. It was really interesting to me to have the dialogue going between and that's what I basically was I just was a observer and I was watching a dialogue between Devin and all the throwers. Um, Devin and Donny and you guys the knowledge that you guys have accumulated and we're trying to understand is like the the stuff that isn't quantified in this paper but like those conversations to me were super interesting where you're talking about this dart flies better with this at atlatl. 07:06.45 Cornpop Yeah. 07:08.22 mr_ sad Or this one goes here or or what what? Donny specifically found one that he was like really dowled in with that he called Delilah all old the old. 07:16.13 Cornpop That's right number 7 07:17.70 archpodnet But then he also he also showed me how like if you wiggle the at Ladle and wherever the flex is you want that on its side so you want the stiffer parts was not all wood is equal which is like duh and I was able to once I figured out which side needed to be pointed up I could throw those things but man that. 400 graham dart that thing was heavy like I had to I've never done it before but I had to hold it with my other hand. My non-firing hand and like throw it up just so I can throw the damn dart. 07:36.85 Cornpop Dude. 07:46.18 Cornpop I couldn't reach it. It's dull. 07:50.34 mr_ sad Yeah, and when that one the the penetration power I I pulled every single time I pulled it out. Retrieved it from it like I I ripped out all the components like it it and and it was definitely. You didn't get that wiggle as much that you really see on like the arrows like it was a very like. 07:58.87 archpodnet Yeah. 08:04.98 archpodnet Um. 08:05.28 Cornpop Um, yeah. 08:10.32 mr_ sad What what is it like frequency is out they call it night flex. Yeah, the spline. Yeah yeah I was much much. 08:10.90 Cornpop Ah, the um yeah, the spline. Yeah yeah, because you're essentially throwing a javelin. Yeah. 08:11.74 archpodnet The flex. Yeah and they traveled so much slower. Yeah, like it was it was weird like is that really light dart because we were all using heavy out lats with banner stones and like none of us. Could throw that damn thing. 08:29.92 Cornpop It it was heavy. Ah, and ah what I fucking lobbed it right into the target when the cameras weren't rolling and I was really bummed about it. Um, but my favorite part of the whole thing and just Devin being Devin. He has like just a a bandolier of atlats I can only explain to this that like there's like 40 of them and he just rolls them out onto like a blanket and I was like hey do you have one that's like ah, an aztec one and he just like roots through him and he's like yeah cans meet this one. He's like it's actually. Based off like the codices they found in Munich and like you know it's actually built exactly and I was like all right, that's fine I want the aztec one and I think Lana was like you throw them so fast and I was like yeah I just pretend they're my endcap if just or aztec capped doesn't remember what it said. But yes, so. 09:11.78 archpodnet She ah. 09:20.86 Cornpop For whatever reason I did well with that aztec one. It was really cool just the way it like it throw. Um, yeah, um, that. 09:24.66 archpodnet Yeah, and so we're going to have Devin back on. He's going to run the data. So we're gonna have Devin on to talk more critically about the paper itself and what we're trying to do and it's not like it's just nice to have Devin because Devyn is kind of like right now like 1 of the leading experts in like ballistics. And like and not only ballistics but like how you to make analogous. Um, yeah and how to make research projects that are analogous that actually capture what we're trying to capture because so often like there's a reason why throwing things into clay isn't good. 09:48.58 Cornpop He's the out loud guy. 09:59.91 archpodnet Or even like some certain ballistics gelatin which he found out through some of these experiments with the high-speed cameras being able to detect how they interact with the dart so like he's learning all this stuff and so just having him at our at our fingertips um is is incredible. Um. And then we all dipped out early. We left chance Tom and Devin up there because I had to go to Colorado springs and David you had to go to the airport. 10:22.72 Cornpop I did I learned as an in and out in Denver we went and went to there. Yeah yeah and I got some message requests like bro you're in callli and I was like nope specifically said hear it in an outbreaker in Denver Colorado not a palm tree in sight. 10:26.34 archpodnet Um, that's good. 10:29.41 mr_ sad Yeah. 10:40.34 mr_ sad If you haven't watched the video he he does a cujie Ko a. 10:45.70 Cornpop Goe ah um, ah waterburger is good in and out is like in and out. It's like it's a cultural thing like if I'm in California I'll head an in and out if I'm in Texas I'll do a waterburger but I believe waburger. 10:46.19 archpodnet Are you guys want a burger or in and out. 10:52.50 mr_ sad I've never had 1 burger. 10:56.15 archpodnet The. 11:02.28 archpodnet Yeah, they have I mean they have a larger menu and they have like really good breakfast like I'll like yeah the the secret menu in in and out is just goofy. It's like animal style 2 by 2 3 by 3 It's like it's really not that secret. 11:02.74 Cornpop I think tastes better. 11:07.77 Cornpop You got to know like the secret menu of Ann Out burger. Yeah. 11:10.41 mr_ sad Yeah, in and out. Ah. 11:16.44 Cornpop Ah, the protein animal style. We saw a kid just destroying ah like ah ah like a lettuce wrapped burger like it was yeah. 11:21.44 archpodnet Yeah. 11:23.88 mr_ sad Yeah, protein style. Yeah so I want to take you want you to take that burricical in back. Go a piss on it 2 by 2 3 by 3 throw it with the animals. Get it be wild. That's that's the that stand in out order. That's how you order there. 11:36.70 Cornpop For what? oh oh oh right? The animals. Yeah yeah. 11:37.14 archpodnet Let's see. 11:40.96 archpodnet They had 1 in Salt Lake City and ah you could ask for fry sauce and I was like super stoked and all they did was just use Thousand Island dressing and it was gross and made me throw up later I'm like that's not that's not fry sauce. Yeah, they just. 11:43.24 mr_ sad Ah. 11:52.24 Cornpop I Think that's what animal style is. It's just like it's out with caramelized onions or something. Yeah. 11:59.40 archpodnet But know yeah, the animal style has that sauce on it but like specifically in Utah there's that fry sauce culture and I think they messed up when they first showed up with like here's our fri sauce. It's like no, that's just your animal style sauce and it's disgusting with fries. 12:03.33 Cornpop Oh. 12:12.71 Cornpop Got it? Um, yeah, and then um, went to the airport. Ah I forgot my headphones. It was just kind of a miserable experience. But ah that this really isn't relevant to the podcast I had something to say before that what we were talking about before in and out. Um. 12:30.64 archpodnet Science Spiral reality. 12:32.54 Cornpop The rest of the day. Oh well. Yeah that um, no boulders like a lovely town I like really enjoyed it there. A lot of homeless people. Um the and outta place is good. Um, yeah yeah, ah. 12:32.91 mr_ sad Experimental. Ok I. 12:39.48 archpodnet Yeah. 12:45.85 mr_ sad That's so good. You can eat to eat it twice I hear. 12:47.19 archpodnet I Love that infant outta joint I have so many leftovers in my fridge right now like I'm move I should know by tomorrow if I got that job but I use so by the time this comes out I'll either be happy or crying. 12:51.12 Cornpop Is really good. Ah. 12:58.61 Cornpop Um, good. 13:01.35 mr_ sad Oh oh, we have to get we have to give an apology for for something. Our latest episode is going to be released a day late. Yeah episode one seven we we have. 13:06.84 archpodnet What. Of the but that will already be out by the time this comes out. 13:19.19 mr_ sad Have released late for once and our 108 times doing this are hundred and seven times doing it. Yeah. 13:23.50 archpodnet We had a busy two weeks like we've yeah we've had like these past two weeks haven't been good with job interviews. 13:25.59 Cornpop Yeah I mean there was a ball in which I may have not needed to drop but I could have not dropped but ah yes, but it was busy and I was flying and it was a two day turnaround 13:38.78 mr_ sad Yeah, or just I'm just formalized formally apologizing I know you. 13:40.44 archpodnet It'll be fine one day late won't destroy us. 13:41.99 Cornpop Um, yeah I guess that's true because like I do listen to a lot of podcasts Monday morning and if it's not there I'm like ah damn, but then I go look for it again. So that's here. 13:44.92 archpodnet That. 13:53.53 archpodnet No, one's emailed us. So I think it should be okay. 13:58.59 mr_ sad Wait are we checked and see if people are still listening. Oh. 14:00.70 Cornpop Um. Um, um, well I. 14:04.70 archpodnet Unfortunately, they are. 14:14.83 archpodnet Oh dude, have you guys seen the the comet people are still on their on their shit. The impact hypothesis folks. We did that the hope well one remember they came out with another one and they're just getting I Just don't I Just don't get it. 14:14.91 Cornpop A book. 14:21.81 Cornpop Ah, yeah, um. 14:26.88 mr_ sad Yay. 14:31.37 mr_ sad Is it a. 14:33.50 Cornpop It's It's a cold man people really like the impact hypothesis because it's like just because it's counter culture to Mainstream Archeology I don't know it treasure What makes sense. 14:36.18 archpodnet I guess. 14:44.10 archpodnet Because it sounds cool like asteroid comes out wipes out civilization. It's like that's not how that works to the lay minute makes sense. 14:51.15 Cornpop Yeah, or catch allll. Yeah I got yeah what I mean? Um, yeah guys I'm going to apologize on behalf of the 3 of us. Ah, the brain cells are gone. Um, there was other. 15:06.00 archpodnet I'm having fever dreams like while we're recording like. 15:08.69 Cornpop There were other funny things that happened this weekend I'm not going to discuss the whiteboard. Um, what else. 15:11.28 mr_ sad Oh ah oh I I did tell everyone our our dirty secret about how we have dark dark humor. So to that cat is out of the bag. So we're sorry at least I told Georgia and your other friend I was like. 15:25.60 Cornpop Ah, yeah, Georgia's dope 15:30.44 mr_ sad Ah, by the way. Yeah, go listen there. Goal listen her episode. She's the best. 15:30.71 archpodnet Yeah, we didn't have her back on. 15:37.50 Cornpop I've not yet to meet somebody with as much awkward energy as me. Um, like I said something and she like did like that. What's that little fortnight dance. Ah, the the how everyone flossing like she just like. 15:41.00 mr_ sad Oh yeah. 15:46.33 archpodnet Oh I don't know. 15:53.82 mr_ sad She's lost. Do you want to talk about our experienced downtown interacting with people. 15:54.10 Cornpop I've never seen a 30 year old person floss 40 times and at night I think she's 28 here remember? Um, yeah. 16:06.92 archpodnet Yeah, what did you guys? do. 16:07.15 Cornpop Oh oh yeah I forgot about that I thought you meant the drug deal I saw at the hotel because I did see that. Ah but I parked and I was like why are these guys staring at me so weird and so close to each other at the front door of the car and I was like oh um. 16:15.80 mr_ sad It's It's what it is. 16:24.41 Cornpop Yeah I went downtown and I just interviewed people as like what's it mean to be human. Um I think by the time this episode comes out I'll help I'll put it on Youtube but Carlton did you get a chance to pop that listen tell the one I see the one I showed you. 16:35.50 archpodnet Yeah, yeah, I'd like look I think he had already shown it to lana so she was laughing. 16:39.48 Cornpop This? Okay so like I love channel 5 news they're all gas no breaks because like it is just it's like such a funny style of like comedy for me or like to me. Um and I was not expecting to get a person like that by interviewing I think what 12 people. And everyone was like yeah I think being humans like you know it's like loving god or someone was like I I think it's just like you know, being good to each other and this guy's like man there's people when the government's off done. They're go to be hiding out in the australian outback. There's these underground bunkers. The sky is made a glass. It's gonna come down and the thing is. I thought this guy like as he was he came on so normal like I mean I would say neurotypical um and sober like he seemed like a ah with it person with his first answer. He's like yeah, be good. Everybody like there's no races. There's no ethnices. We're all human. And then it just went off the rails and then he would come back every 3 minutes and be like so what's it mean to be human I don't know but then he would talk about like volcanoes and like it was the wildest interview I've ever had in my life and I was trying my best to like hold it together but the whole time I was like is this man schizophrenic is he on acid currently no. I think he genuinely believes these conspiracies and he is a very intelligent man who does so it's very confusing to me. Ah, but yeah, that's what that was. That's what that was um and that's why like I impromptu asked you and Donny that up on the hilltop which I also edited that in today Carlton because like. Donnie gives an answer and then like I go up to Carlton who literally just gets his ph d and you were like I don't know but it's because like you had no brain cells and then 30 seconds later you come back with like a dissertation of an answer It's so impressive. 18:18.22 mr_ sad And. 18:23.48 mr_ sad All then and then on that Donny takes the mic from you and then interviews you and he're like going back and forth it was but it was really wild. So I was helping film. Um and the. 18:23.60 archpodnet I see I just needed a second because Donny took all my answers when I was thinking so I needed like a second to recalibrate. 18:29.48 Cornpop Ah, he took it. Yeah, like tried to eat the microphone. 18:43.45 mr_ sad The answers we got varied pretty insanely. 18:46.60 Cornpop Yeah, it was like really interesting to see how people answered them. Yeah, so I'm going to try that in Nashville and stuff and I'll do one in New York when I'm up there next? Oh I interviewed the pigeons I interviewed that racist statue cow the cow statue. 18:52.80 mr_ sad Yeah, it like tells Oh don't don't forget about the pigeons we got the pigeons too. 19:05.70 Cornpop Um. 19:08.20 mr_ sad There's there's a cow statue and I was just like random like like we just film pigeons or something you like walking up to him and I was like go ghost I mean to be and they walk up to the cow or it's like go full glass the cow he said what did you say. 19:16.82 Cornpop What's it mean to be a pigeon. 19:23.79 Cornpop Like I was like what's it mean to be a bovind creature and then I like put my ear up closer to it This construction work looking at me like I'm insane and then I was like as a great answer real racist though. People just thought we were nuts. Um, yeah. 19:35.43 mr_ sad Ah. 19:43.58 Cornpop Um, and then we went and got drinks. That's right, yeah, that was Friday for us and I had I had woken up at four zero a m in Nashville to get on the plane I flew out there. We met either 8 a m at the airport in Denver and then we did that and then immediately got drinks at like noon and like 3 of them deep I was like we' were walking around downtown just like. Already ready to roll and we brought brought it back to alcoholism and on that note, we're going we in the end the episode ah please jerk responsibly. 20:10.40 archpodnet So yeah, so thank you everyone so much for listening? Yeah, but do that if you're listening on the all shows feed please consider helping us out by going to our show a life ands podcast subscribing to our individual show and listening to us there. It helps us grow our grow our audience. Um, and gives us data to give to potential sponsors and advertisers. So we can get better deals and make much more creative content and the more money that our podcast makes the more attention we get from David and we need his skill set so please. 20:34.38 mr_ sad I. 20:41.80 Cornpop No um Carlton before we end I just want to tell you and I said it like 18 times this weekend I'm very fucking proud of you and I love you and you're you're a really good dude and it like really showed this weekend. 20:54.88 archpodnet I Love you guys too. This was a lot of fun I was super stoked to see you guys coming I was like really happy that you guys were there and I kept telling a lot of people I was just like I am so overwhelmed right now but I am genuinely very happy to see you. 21:07.37 Cornpop Yeah. 21:07.76 mr_ sad No, they Yeah, we're we're super proud of you and you the reason this podcast does any good and if you want to rehash that argument right now I will I will start I will I will go get a beer and I will just get. 21:14.46 Cornpop Guys oh Hashtag episode 1 Oh 6 of liferooms podcast. Check it out. Ah oh but ah wait no I'm supposed to do that. Ah. 21:14.83 archpodnet I fucking kill you right now. How will I will talk to Georgia and have a drone sent in your way within 2 hours excellent all right guys and with that we are out. But. 21:25.44 mr_ sad Um. 21:34.20 Cornpop What's that What's my it's so when we have a gas is supposed to ask social media handles never mind. We're done wait. Oh please rate review the podcast you did all that all right sells are. 21:40.21 archpodnet Yeah, yeah, please rate and review the podcast all that whole stuff. Yeah, we don't have any new reviews. Um Connor what's the joke for the week 21:51.10 mr_ sad Um, a dung beetle walks into a bar and ask is this stool taken. 22:00.34 Cornpop Ah, that's good man. That's a good one. Keep my. 22:01.17 archpodnet Ah, ah, ah, thank you? Connor and with that we are out.