00:00.00 archpodnet Welcome back to episode 1 24 of a light ruins podcast David's mumbling in the background like a blithering idiot. 00:00.66 Jesus of Nayarit Was in with holding Pipe pi. 00:08.14 Jesus of Nayarit It was in this moment when all hope had faded that is zealor son of the king took up his father's sword and the enemies of the free peoples of in Earth was defeated the ring passed to a ilorre all right. 00:22.24 archpodnet Now Saron was defeated. No no, not at all. 00:25.27 Jesus of Nayarit Do you want to continue because I I know. 00:33.56 archpodnet Um, so on the same sort of topic I was thinking as also true to the fire. Um on the same sort of topic. So if you are a professor or if you're a teacher or if you're. Ah, person who does archaeology and you have to teach other people about it. How do you deal with controversies like this in the classroom in the field setting like if you so if an undergrad came came up to you when you're at laprell as part of the field school and was like. 01:02.62 Jesus of Nayarit I. 01:10.90 archpodnet You know I heard this ah just thing about this Sauddi Mast on site. You know it's pretty cool that like Homo erectus was like popping into the Us and smashing up mammoths like how do you? How do you teach that in that moment. 01:26.36 Jesus of Nayarit I have a real life example with Kenneck Man I guess but that's a little different I was talking about Kennewick man and nag proud given a presentation for the previous program I worked for and. 01:32.38 archpodnet No, that's good. Whatever whatever it is. 01:44.70 Jesus of Nayarit I'd mentioned like the whole thing with him being like he had caucasoid features is what they they listed or Caucasian features. It's been of the word they used um and a guy in like the like the audio of the lab asked me like in the middle of the presentation like does that mean he I can't remember exactly what he asked but like I was like. I think and obviously in the lecture I said that doesn't mean he was white or caucasian it just meant he had those features and the guy was like well doesn't that mean he's like from east of the caucus mountains and I was like I mean North America is technically east of the caucus mountains. Yes, but like i. I don't know I'll get back to you and like I kind of just like because I think it was just they said that he had caucusoid features was like what what it was. But anyway in that moment I didn't have an answer I didn't want to like stop the lecture to think about it or look it up I was just like I will get back to you and like after class. After the lecture like I sat down I was like so what was your question and they'll go in over it. That's how I've always done it and I had an anatomy teacher in high school who if you asked him it like somebody was like what's a pancreas and he was like you know what? I think I know what it does that was an example but it was something something pretty specific. And he was like I don't know the answer but I will get back to you with it and I always thought that was like a good thing to do because some people will just give you an answer and like make it up on a fly or combat you um. 03:03.68 archpodnet Yeah, so you take like a moment back to to process your thoughts and and then tell that. 03:12.86 Jesus of Nayarit Yeah, and especially with like a question like that like a Pre-clovis or like a genetics one or like you know so human evolution one where someone asks that to the whole class. Especially if you're teaching a lecture hall Like. It would be awkward to make it into a whole like open form discussion while you still have to go over the lesson or like the lecture. So like I think it's just best to be like I mean in the moment. It's be like let's talk after class but then because people don't like confrontation and then the confrontation would start with the person asking the question and that's on them. Um. 03:44.38 archpodnet Meant. 03:48.78 Jesus of Nayarit But yeah I don't know man I Guess where you asking the public in general What they think. 03:52.49 archpodnet Well I was just thinking so like um as part of your syllabus your outline would you teach pre-cloviss versus Clovis sites would you have that information presented to them. Um, in a way that's like hey this is the information. Um, this is this is the site. This is the things they say happened this is the criticism. Um I feel like you have to like or if I was teaching I would try to build it in so you you at least give give a platform for discussion about those things but but I also would I could also understand. And see taking the tact of like not teaching it because it's not accepted science and that's what they're here for They're like a 100 level course and they expect you to just teach you what the facts are you know? so like it's I feel like it's both ways you could either be like completely ignore these like. Outlying science like outlier stuff or you could use it as a teachable moment and be like this is what people are saying. This is the context this is the criticisms etc I I find I think it would be a very difficult like decision to make. 05:00.77 Jesus of Nayarit Yeah I mean I think you're out of the money. The closest thing I've done I guess to that is like I did a post on horses and I said that like you know, horses went extinct in the pleistocene here or at the Holocene transition and then they weren't. Brought back until the Spanish reintroduced them on accident. Um, well I mean I guess they brought the horses on purpose. But um, yeah, it's like a Rat just was on the ship. Um I know? Yeah, Ah so yeah. 05:25.17 archpodnet Yeah, how this how this horse get on here. It's bill. It's bill the pony. 05:36.30 Jesus of Nayarit Ah. 05:38.13 archpodnet Bill what the fuck are you doing on here. 05:39.77 Jesus of Nayarit And names some paba and a navi the um know we have a horse on the ship for for the non the non ispani dulantes. So but what I said was like horses won extained yada yada and then I posted in a comment edit there is however. Um, research that suggests their horses existed via native like research of Native American Oral traditions that does state that horses existed ah prior after the pleistocene up until today and I said. However, there is not enough data for me to say this is true or not or something like that and I I said that was the case but I said my opinion at the end of it. But I also said there's just no data to there's no physical evidence to prove it at this current moment I think it's what I said yeah it exists but there's no. Physical evidence to to prove. Otherwise so what I did was you know, add the indigenous belief system or the indigenous you know research to it. Um, do I believe that take that back Chris one just gonna be like no. Go back to? Um, do I agree with that I don't necessarily know cause I haven't talked with the people she studied in that and that in that study or her book that she's writing or their book. However I don't see any physical evidence for it. So therefore like I might have the right to my opinion. 07:13.64 Jesus of Nayarit But the post wasn't about that the post was about something else and I got someone that messaged me and said like you know like writing that only gives more credence to it and I was like yeah I know but like I still need to write it because it's a counterargument to it and it's one of those moments where I'm like like I could just leave it out. But then I'm also being a colonist by not adding in the indigenous part you know so and it's this weird Rope you gotta walk. 07:37.22 archpodnet yeah yeah I mean yeah and if if you you, you know those comments you'll get on that thing will be like where's the counter argument whatso. What about Paulette Steve's what about blah blah blah blah blah. So it's like but I think as a as a good scientist you. 07:51.46 Jesus of Nayarit So they right? as. 07:56.68 archpodnet Present the information. Um on both sides and and and do the best you can I don't I feel like that. 08:01.00 Jesus of Nayarit At think I'm do though Carlton being indigenous himself also thinks it's complete bullshit. So like what do do I also add that as a comment then do like I don't know it I guess we're gettingt more into that sorry I just completely interrupted you but no. 08:15.80 archpodnet No, it's like it's it's the nuance of it and I think the tact of like presenting. Both sides is good but I Also there's also like a combative nature to it like you want to you want to give both sides but you also want to be sure that people understand what is accepted and what is not. You know. 08:35.13 Jesus of Nayarit And yeah, um I shouldn't say Carlton thinks it's complete horseshit. He hasn't said that Verbatim Carlton may give his own answer on that. But I believe that is where he's out on it. Don't quote me but I think it's in the in in in the realm of na. 08:51.43 archpodnet Chris cut Chris just got that part where we put Carlton's damon there about what he wants what he thinks about it please. 08:52.57 Jesus of Nayarit Ah, he's probably he said that on here. Yeah, great. 09:02.50 Jesus of Nayarit Um, I'll hear I'll say this statement an indigenous colleague of ours has said that that might not be accurate. It's there we go um fit sorry you're gonna have to figure out what to do with that or just cut it out if it sounds bad. Ah anyway. 09:08.74 archpodnet Yeah, and. 09:19.83 Jesus of Nayarit So yes, it's hard I Forget what your original question was at this point but it's along these lines. 09:22.51 archpodnet No, it's just yeah, so it's like what's it's walking the top the fine line of like do you get? Do you do do you? Even let people know about what's his face Triangle guy The what's what's. 09:39.00 Jesus of Nayarit That's triangle guy. 09:42.80 archpodnet Ah I can't even think of his name. That's how dumb I think he is ah smallcock smallcock. Yeah yeah, so like do do you do you put that into the world I got I feel like I'm less privy unless. 09:48.14 Jesus of Nayarit Graham Hancock Graham Hancock yeah 10:00.20 archpodnet Likely to put that in because it's not. 10:00.33 Jesus of Nayarit Oh it's solid example with that with that right there I sent it to the group chat did we have a group chat called the settlers of sarudi this one David F Fs which means for fuck's sake because I never remember which which group text it is guys with Dr Tune and Dr Miller and Dr Gover and Connor and i. 10:21.21 Jesus of Nayarit Plebes and it was It was a scientific American paper that was talking about the existence or the possible theoretical existence of a pre Homo sapien civilization that existed on Earth that was Reptilian or something. Um. And I was like this is the scientific American and the headline of course said scientists suggest or scientists are researching if or something to that extent. Um a pre-indust a Prehuman industrial civilization existed on earth. And like scientists believe or whatever it said was like I don't and I'm a scientist I'm a registered scientist I don't believe that and it like it just like yeah and that's some Grand Hancock hit. 11:04.00 archpodnet Yeah. 11:11.47 archpodnet It's it's it's infuriating like it's not you? Yeah yeah, but that's that's a published scientific journal that people can cite someone could cite that and say according to this. Oh scientific America Oh get? Maybe it's not a full publication but but. 11:22.40 Jesus of Nayarit Um I think it's a it's as a magazine or a news. What a publication? yeah. 11:28.70 archpodnet Yeah, but still I mean like yeah, it's it's it's bullshit dude it's I could just I just picture like ah like a cyber punk like civilization in like America with like they're like like Flippy back hair and like they're they're metal. 11:43.37 Jesus of Nayarit Um, weird. 11:46.88 archpodnet But metal boots. That's what I think of when they say pre or pre are what? yeah yeah, it's like an industrial complex. They're just like oh. 11:50.18 Jesus of Nayarit Pretty homeless api. 11:57.40 Jesus of Nayarit Yeah I on that one and I read the the comments there was a lot of geologists in there and people saying like yeah, that's just not like they also said there's only so much earth you can dig through. And like so much boring has happened on the planet so much drilling for everything you would see a fucking jetsons car or 2 that said like lizard Jesus Died for a sins on the back of it if that existed um and there's just none of it at like so did it just all disintegrate I don't know. Um, and like Amy um, what is her name is that is that Mary Anning's revenge. Yeah, ah, for some reason at water is the Frank Reynolds Shell company on Sonny I was like is that it ah the she also said. 12:34.88 archpodnet At water. Yeah. 12:51.35 Jesus of Nayarit Like and we we didn't argue on the podcast. We just discussed it um, or what would be the words. Yeah like I don't even think we were discussing it. She had just suggested that the anthropocene she doesn't buy it. We're still in the holocene. Because the Anthropocene would suggest that humans have left a geologic signature on the earth I'm not a geologist. Um I can't really weigh in on that. But I personally believe we probably have in many ways like you'd see some kind of staining at least from us being here. Um, and if not like big boreholes into the earth and stuff. But again I'm not a geologist. However, so maybe there was something here a long time ago that is now disintegrated or they built all their stuff out of like shell and shark tooth huts. But like there's no. 13:37.87 archpodnet Some big shark. 13:42.67 Jesus of Nayarit The weapon is for it so to say so like therefore we have a consensus that says okay humans are the first anthropoid intelligent to our degree of intelligence. How do we define intelligence in a pc way. Um, dude. 14:02.19 Jesus of Nayarit I'm not walking on Eggshells humans is the goat work good like intelligence is intelligence all right? so. 14:08.13 archpodnet But and that's the name of this podcast is humans are the goat. 14:15.23 Jesus of Nayarit Um, yeah, ah not the lizard goat not the Reptilian goat just a goat. Um. 14:20.51 archpodnet David what does what does anthropology mean to you. 14:27.20 Jesus of Nayarit Um, gibson city tn I'm not answering that um cut that out I know do do you get ones from like Colorado random number. Yeah I got Tennessee um, anyway, are you seriously asking me that because I'll answer it I guess. 14:30.10 archpodnet Where the fuck is Gipsy city. 14:40.60 archpodnet I Don't know I'm just sticking How do we end this. 14:45.25 Jesus of Nayarit Ah, it's a good question I guess anthropology is kind of it's a philosophy to me like you like anthropologists fundamentally see the world differently from other people. Um, I think a lot of people like don't go out into the the world or like you know I just went to safe way today and like look at everything in terms of like ecological numbers and like these grapes came from frigging Africa and like things like that and like have a small panic attack when you pick up nutella cause you're like none of this came from this continent. And like stuff like that like it. It just fundamentally changes the way you view the world and it is like seeing humans to me as like zoological beings more so than like something different is like awesome to me but also like freaks me out sometimes too because like. Know you see a dude at a bar like talking to a girl you're like cable is primate behavior and then like you're looking out and I'm like I see a steel structure that is the safe way and I'm like cool. It's got bricks on the outside. It has a frame. Okay, we used to do that in the frigging jungle with wood frames and like lashings and stuff but doing the same thing we all need shelter. And like all that goes on in my head like while I'm pushing the cart and I'm like having a small issue every day. But yes, it's like exactly and as Bob said too in which I'll probably tell my kids this forever sheet one of those out. Um, but like it is far. 16:04.56 archpodnet You're like what? Ah what did I What did I come here for. 16:17.70 Jesus of Nayarit Much better of a life to me to be curious about your somali neighbors down the block than to be hostile to them like why do you wear that on your head. Why is your food this way like why is your language that way you know rather than just be like getting them out of here. So It's like. Um, know it's just a.. It's a way to like view life I don't know. 16:40.66 archpodnet Yeah I would I would say like in the same sort of vein. Um, it makes me it has made me a lot more tolerant of people's behavior and understanding people's behavior in the context of the larger world that we live in um traditions. Etc like it really is it gives me a lot of patience with people like because I because I understand your lizard brain right now is like pushing you full anxiety through this moment like you're not in control of it I get that. 17:00.70 Jesus of Nayarit Yeah, like. 17:13.26 archpodnet It's because our ancestors in the past when something bad happened to them. They had to be anxious and on edge to protect themselves. Um, yeah and I think it just yeah I am very much more curious in other people's belief systems things like that and it makes you ask good questions I Think. Like I think fundamentally we are good podcasters or you know mid-level podcasters because we ask questions because we want to know information and we understand people. 17:44.89 Jesus of Nayarit I Think that's good um systems too right? like when we learn that in culture anthropology like I was just thinking and at Safeway there's no posted signs that say like you have to push your cards this direction or like go in this way. Some places do this place doesn't. So humans just kind of like figure it out and like if someone drops something you're like Ill help them Up. You're like I like that or I know like the tacit culture and implicit culture is just interesting to me. 18:10.15 archpodnet Like you go? yeah like well we always go on the right hand side of like the aisles even though we like it's not defined like I feel because that's like ah it's like a traffic lane thing. 18:19.88 Jesus of Nayarit Oh right? Huh Any All the perishable foods are on the outside aisles but like the junk food like and like the carbs are on the inside of the aisles. Um, yeah, it's interesting. Um. 18:30.16 archpodnet Yeah, yeah, well I think on that note, we're going to end this lovely episode this has been life and rose podcast I would not choose to live a life in ruins David would not choose to live life in ruins. Ah, follow us on the social meads. 18:49.80 Jesus of Nayarit If you haven't rated it and reviewed the podcast on the right you the podcast please um, all right on that note Connor how do you feel about black hobbits in the new series. Don't cut that. 18:53.88 archpodnet Read. 19:06.28 Jesus of Nayarit Got that good that got that I I was watching it and I was like you know what? this is cool like I I like it I don't know why people are freaking out I think the people that are freaking out or still recording shoot are like it's just fake. It's people that aren't freaking out that say that people are freaking out. Yeah. 19:11.69 archpodnet Yeah. 19:21.25 archpodnet Yeah, and we are here for the last little bit last little joke segment I wrote this one myself so it is particularly grown full. So you know I Really enjoy like helping out my friends. They always ask me like. What they can charge me I Just say it's pro brono. 19:47.39 Jesus of Nayarit I got one for you would you like? um, would you like some ah goat or some matter baby. 19:59.89 archpodnet So matter baby. 20:07.30 archpodnet And with and with that we are out. 20:08.98 Jesus of Nayarit Are yours.