00:00.00 archpodnet Welcome to episode 145 of a life ruins podcast reinvestigate the Koreas and research of those living a life in ruins I am your host Carlton Gover and I am joined by my co-hosts Conor John and and David Howe ah for this week's episode. We're not joined by anybody. Um, just the 3 of us we have a good outline I think it's going be a fun time. Ah, what are we talking about tonight tonight fellas Connor what are we what are we doing 00:20.18 David Howe And. 00:26.58 connor Vikings me load. 00:28.21 archpodnet Vikings My lord. So. 00:29.18 David Howe Vikings My Lord may I ask? Ah why we changed it from those living life. It ruins now we changed it to a life in ruins and research. 00:40.32 archpodnet Keywords to try to get our godamn podcast on top 10 lists and archaeology and science because for some reason we were not hitting the keywords that were needed to get popped up Becausesudo Pseudo Archeology by canin killa it's beating us on the charts for whatever reason. So so. 00:50.70 David Howe Um, say. 00:54.54 David Howe Low hanging fruit bro. 00:57.86 archpodnet Low hanging fruit and we've also we don't just do the careers anymore. We do start going into research. So I figured we'd we'd hit that we we're moving up. Ah yeah. 01:01.70 David Howe People like the careers people are like I just want to hear about sites and I'm like look look it up yourself. 01:06.24 connor Yeah, careers are dumb. Ah, you got the internet come on. 01:14.48 David Howe Read hancock and just get it over with. 01:15.69 archpodnet Yes, it has changed read hancock. Get it over where where ah yeah, yeah, we'll still do them. But yeah, we do want to talk about research. But so yeah. 01:20.53 connor Don't no no, no, we're alienating all our audience here. So thank you for those who like the the career ones We love them too. Yeah I don't. 01:29.34 David Howe I won't show up. 01:33.10 archpodnet The the impetus for this whole thing was I've been cleaning out my Facebook feed doing some curation of what I'm shown on Facebook and I'm so part of all those archeology groups and I've I've been leaving them because it's they just got so much pseudoar and I saw one post recently. That was about vikings in Oklahoma and I was like you know what? we just did. We've done a couple episodes recently on. Ah you know, um, settling of the Americas and we haven't really talked vikings. It was mentioned in settlers of cirrudi in which we use it as like an outlier in the european settlement of um. Americans I was like you know what we haven't talked vikings. Um the season 2 of ah one of those vikings shows just wrapped up recently. It's like the sequel to vikings about Ragnar Rought Loftbrock you guys don't have talk about yeah season 2 of fall holla just wrapped up and i. 02:24.65 David Howe Vike Insval holli or something. 02:28.65 archpodnet Really good show I was like let's talk about vikings. We have um, something that we can all contribute to. 02:33.20 connor I do love that we also start with vikings and then we're gonna bring it back to the Americas we're because we're selfish little bitches and have to do everything about America. 02:41.62 archpodnet We have to be like we need a we need to clean the slate real quick. Um and also like ah our audience is probably gonna be interested in this so we want to this is what we're gonna do so we're gonna we're Goingnna Outline what we're gonna talk about. 02:54.78 David Howe What we're gonna do is I'm going to pull up my 23 and me and actually show the world. How much viking I actually have because that one's like I have viking dna first off, do you have cooper dna. Do you have Shoemaker Dna oh do you have wagon writer dna. No, you don't you have Scandinavian Dna you plebe. 03:17.48 archpodnet Do plebe how much how much parvo Dna do people have um, you know, ah different star. She don't have you don't have barb up. Ah. 03:21.65 connor Ah, did not expect it to go this way. Oh hey who par positive par par par for par for the coast. 03:28.40 David Howe I have parvo. So. 03:34.59 archpodnet Yeah, had it apparently. 03:38.34 connor Post. Yeah. 03:38.59 David Howe Um, shut up. Ah. 03:42.51 connor Okay, what? what are you using. 03:44.44 archpodnet Okay, so so real quick red is ah a summary of the vikings. So vikings right? Everyone there's a romanticization of vikings and popular culture. Everyone thinks they're warriors but vikings are really seafarers and traders like. 03:45.59 David Howe Hang on as this tradition I forgot by fricking password. 04:01.68 archpodnet Baseline that's what they do you'll find them originally starting out in Scandinavia so this is really including like Denmark Norway Sweden and Finland and we're talking about like the late eighth century to late eleventh Century common era or a d so seven hundred s to. 10 hundreds that I do that right. 04:23.12 connor Yeah, that you did. 04:25.11 David Howe Yes, it just so happens to be around the middle of the warming period which causes a lot of ah lot of let's say anxiety to be so be safe around the world. 04:27.72 archpodnet Yes. 04:38.72 David Howe It causes mongols it causes the iroquois to start bashing each other's brains in it causes the crusades causes a lot of problems. 04:48.80 archpodnet Yes, um, 100% well it crusades come later. 04:54.50 David Howe Ah, yes, but here's the the the medieval warm period that caused all of the like crops and shit to fail over the world made Europe like be like who we don't have nothing and ever all the muslims in the Middle East had everything and they were like oh you know what. 05:00.83 archpodnet I'm have to stack Check this move Oneer gri. 05:11.41 David Howe Day is vote mid old and they went and just killed all of them. 05:14.10 archpodnet Yes, okay, so the medieval war we period for everyone. It's from 800 to 1200 so the viking period happens like it just as the start of it but ends half midway. Um. 05:24.78 David Howe It's almost like the people that were farming in Scandinavia had nothing. You know they were famining and crop failing so they had to go steal shit from other people. 05:32.42 archpodnet Yes, and towards the yeah. 05:33.86 connor Yeah, and Carlton I were talking about this too is like um so in in the context like england's kind of like fallen apart Europe in general is kind of falling apart during this period and not not doing super good. 05:45.40 archpodnet Right? So the the holy the roman empire in the west out of Rome has fallen by the fifth century sixth century a d and then it's it moves to bazi to Byzantium Constantinople then the byzantine empire eastern whole the Roman Empire so like some of those old Roman Holdouts in England France they're going by the wayside england is a mix of different kingdoms like it's not It's like reconfiguring itself as vikings or these these norse folks begin to start doing their raids and and it's not. Doing it out of blood lust which is how it's often romanticized like these people want farmland like that's that's kind of the impetus like scandinavianot a great place to be a farmer like having farmland is a status symbol. Um, and so that's what they're coveting in England is rich in farmland and they start raiding. 06:22.13 David Howe Now will. 06:39.49 archpodnet England doesn't unify and they so kind of start using vikings to their advantage. So it's not like these nort and there's different Norse factions. So there's factions within the vikings. There's factions within England and France and they're all vying for power in 1 way or another so it's not a homogeneous vikings verse english. It's there's there's a lot more geopolitics that are at play here in which they're using each other really to set up ikings for farmland and that's date and then yeah, yes, David. 07:04.90 David Howe Are ah. 07:06.55 David Howe North Northumbria mercia East anglia essex wesex sussex Kent Wales and strath slidede strathhede is that the word there were there were the kingdoms that existed after the fall of Rome in Britain of like it was basically a warring states. Um, and they would fight each other but while that was happening the normans who were norse themselves from France were invading with William the conquer but at the same time the vikings in scandinavian people were migrating from this quote migrating from scandinavia to the northern parts of England which is. 07:39.65 archpodnet So the first viking raids are seven ninety three and Norton and the normans come over at the end of the viking age in 1066 and wrap it all up. So it's vikings from scandinavia they're also in France which is a whole different thing and then kind of settle this up. Yeah William the conqueror comes in. 07:40.00 connor So a. 07:47.83 David Howe Me. 07:58.30 archpodnet Um, he's Norman Viking and he set he settles everything in England and that's the end of the viking age in 1066 and that's when we start getting to the mid and late medieval period and then that sets the stage for unified england um, for the oh. 08:10.83 David Howe And author there out for alfred sorry. 08:15.25 archpodnet Dean's gonna get mad at us because we always fuck up England united kingdom so I think it's just england at this point. 08:20.60 David Howe It's England Ireland and Scotland like the whole British Isles is british is what he said but english is different than british like english is people who live in England he said irish irish people might debate that they're not part of Britain. 08:30.60 archpodnet Yeah, so I think oh. 08:36.57 David Howe But the british isles but it's technically an island off of Britain you know like that? Yeah, oh. 08:37.78 archpodnet Yeah I think there's a United Kingdom department 08:38.76 connor In the kingdom yeah is not doesn't include Northern Ireland is that correct because they're or no guilt are Ireland proper. Okay, yeah, see when you yeah, there's a little over that. 08:45.76 archpodnet So ireland proper yes of the of the united of the united of the United Kingdom Britain is different. Yeah so ah. 08:47.26 David Howe Yeah, North Island is definitely part of written. 08:59.65 archpodnet So the vikings aren't this like militaristic Holy shit badass that show up. It's just a very interesting geopolitical world in in Northern and Western Europe exactly and they come in with some tactics like the Shield wall. Um that that really is able to. 09:09.26 David Howe They're not the mongols. 09:18.88 archpodnet Ah, capitalize on military tactics post um Roman Empire in in England but anytime like courses in calvary really get involved in these battles. It goes south for the vikings pretty quick but they are also like larger people generally we have that from the archeological record. As well as historic documents we're talking about a group of people that are heavily invested in eating protein cheese milk cattle and they're they're like six foot tall people that show up to these like medieval early medieval peasants in England who are like five five maybe 09:52.85 David Howe What bunch of short Kings be load. 09:54.28 archpodnet Um, so there is some bioethology at play here in terms of diet that is affecting the ability of of of the warrior class but it's. 10:01.46 David Howe Are you are we saying that human variation exists between different groups of people. No oh. 10:12.13 connor Yeah, you couldn't You couldn't make the nail on the head. So if you're looking at it. 10:13.34 David Howe The emphasis where I was I was hoping one of you guys would would jump into that. 10:13.79 archpodnet I was going to make a cranial morphology joke I Just don't know how to format it. So if you measure the heads What we see right? So it's like ah the that was a horrible stutter and I apologize for those listening. 10:30.27 David Howe My man. 10:30.38 connor Crystal cut it out. 10:30.91 archpodnet Um, it's it's a lot as as a theme of this podcast. It's way more complicated than than it. It seems um and also at the same time like these people they're trying to. They're farmers and their traders they're trying to access more farmland. Um, we also have viking the the rurich dynasty took control over territories in the east specifically with the slobs and the finns in eastern europe they annexed Kiev in 90 and that's where the kievvan rose come up so they are like vikings but they're called the Kiev and Rose and they start using their um. Trading really with the byzantine empire so they're they're really trying to They're the first people to really connect directly Northern Europe in Scandinavia with the rest of the Mediterranean world to really create the european sphere of of control. 11:21.68 David Howe Kit. 11:21.84 archpodnet We know of today like this is where it kind of starts this is where scandinavia has entered the chat in terms of being in the political world of the greater european continent. Sure. 11:31.10 David Howe Can I add something here. Um there the the first surviving account of a viking funeral ah comes from an arab trader actually who was in Kev or like in the slavic lands up there. And was trading for furs and he was trading like silver and gold and stuff with the the roosts that were up there and like they were like hey like their chief had just died and he's writing about it and he's like these people are like filthy they spit into the same like barrel of water that they wash like they all pass it down and wash and he's like they have. They said they were promiscuous and had no dignity or like whatsoever. Ah according to an arab wealthy men at the time so like they were probably just people living in the woods but like ah they they sacrificed 1 of the slaves to be with the king and stuff like that and like burn the long ship and stuff and like that's all from an arabic account. Which to your point Carlton it's like they've entered the chat like you don't think about vikings and arabs ever interacting like it's cool. 12:28.16 archpodnet Right. 12:29.30 connor Yeah, and you have evidence down even in like to to Baghdad of vikings making it down there at least in terms of trade goods and things like that I think something we're kind of skipping over a little bit is just the use of waterways and boats is like the most important thing they're not. 12:44.56 archpodnet Um, with. 12:47.82 connor Like Carlton had mentioned. They're not cavalry. They're not invading large chunks of land what they're doing is using the waterways and ports to create these trading networks maybe annexing small areas of Scandinavia Europe Britain Etc. 13:04.20 archpodnet Good help solve. 13:07.11 connor But they're they're not really traveling Inland because their strength and their economy is really built on Boats trading and um stuff like that. 13:17.50 archpodnet Unless it's yeah yeah, they can get in because the the viking vessels. The long ship is amazing work of engineering because it has a it has ah a shallow draft in the water. So it only sinks like a couple feet. It has a very like broad hall at the bottom. 13:19.60 David Howe Maritime. 13:36.58 archpodnet Um, and it's able. It's an ocean going vessel and it can go riverways so like unlike other boats at the time you either had your freshwater vessels or your ocean-go vessels. You didn't have one and all and that's what the viking longship was so they're able to sail out of the fjords in Scandinavia up the river taames down whatever river the scene. 13:54.83 David Howe Sign. 13:55.67 archpodnet Whatever's in France. Yeah, so they they can penetrate deep without changing and these are small sleek. Go like very pretty looking vessels that can get into deep arteries pretty quick without you noticing them. Um lack calvary. 13:55.67 connor This design. 14:08.76 connor Yeah, they can make it to like they can make it to like the Caspian and black sea down the danube like that's that's super impressive and not something you normally see. 14:17.48 archpodnet Yeah. 14:18.40 David Howe And they're light enough to like take an ocean fair but they can also be carried on like logs and stuff like pretty easily which I think was the but yes going up channels and stuff was like what made them super effective and efficient. Um. 14:31.15 archpodnet Yeah, going up? Rivers It's and they're single mass ships like they're pretty easy to relative to some of those other oceangoing vessels you can make a lot of these and that's what these viking traders did and they come in different forms and they're just really cool feats of engineering that were. Really, that was the technology the technology that really allowed the vikings to capitalize on being connected into this this globalized trade system. Um, theyre yeah I mean everyone's seen them and they're also um, they're symmetrical both in the um in the aft in the what's the front of a ship. 15:08.15 David Howe The prow or that this the the. 15:09.80 archpodnet That's not the keel. That's the bottom the prow so they could like turn around super quick. You could just stop what you're doing like turn ° and so and row the other way and it's still as effective as you know they're really cool ships that allowed them as as we've said and what we'll allude to later to get to um Denmark. 15:25.48 David Howe Sorry Bow Bow prout is the very front of it. Yeah. 15:28.53 archpodnet Iceland now. Ah, they're able to follow to get to Iceland Greenland and then very briefly Newfoundland in Eastern Canada so really were. 15:37.97 connor Could you could you say that that the vikings used their boats similar to how genghis Khan used horses and that that's like they just used it in a way that was never seen before. 15:45.96 archpodnet I Think so. 15:52.51 David Howe Yeah, like a technology that was spread very fat like effective in areas that it wasn't like endemic to yeah and horses were all over. But yeah. 16:00.63 archpodnet Yeah, because they were able to. 16:00.93 connor Like and like hit and run tactics and kind of like that I mean so and so were Boats Boats were war horses were everywhere but this is like a new use of it that is so unique that allows them to kind of thrive and expand over large periods. 16:11.83 David Howe Um, um. 16:18.57 archpodnet Yeah, it's like it's like the Aircraft carrier. You know it's kind of that same thing like it was a radical transition in Naval warfare like put a bunch of fucking planes on a ship and now you don't have these major ship to ship battles with battleships anymore. Now it's like fleets throwing air. Yeah now you're just throwing Aircraft at each other. 16:20.22 connor Or large key you graphic areas. 16:20.51 David Howe Um, yeah. 16:33.50 David Howe Mushroomed out norwigens. 16:36.69 archpodnet Like a bunch of darts to a dartboard and s sinking them from a distance and that's how like battleships ended so like very similar the introduction of the viking ship was a radical change in seafaring that allowed vikings with one ship to to trade and fresh and salt water across the Mediterranean and North Atlantic 16:53.70 David Howe Yeah. 16:55.62 archpodnet Um, absolutely fascinating and on that note, we'll be right back. We're going to dive into viking settlements Iceland Greenland and then can and then Canada I don't I don't know I've been watching I've been watching so much Chris de sthano. 17:04.48 David Howe Oh what is what is up with the New York Exit today 17:05.72 connor Are we good? are yeah yeah, are we gonna dive into your accident accident. 17:13.87 David Howe What can you do. 17:14.89 archpodnet And then listen to David when David gives the terms to the people on see if thieves. It's just like it's just rather up. 17:19.53 David Howe I got it pretend I'm on a longboat. We're playing to see if thieves what you can do is interact sick people. You can interact with them and I get on the fucking prow of the ship and I go all right here's how this is gonna go you got 2 options the second one really going to suck for you. The first one lay down your arms climb to the top of the sailboat your crow's nest raise the ions flag you have 10 seconds and this one else New Zealand kid was like ah ah the first one? Yes sir yes, sir. 17:52.77 archpodnet I forget how many children play that game but we just get on their bully teenagers the entire time like listen anyways, we'll be right back with episode one forty five live for its podcast. 17:56.81 connor And I. 17:57.30 David Howe All right? So but.