00:00.00 connor So Oak Island is in Nova Scotia and Canada so we're getting closer. 00:06.86 David Howe Um, that's not too far fetch then I mean like is that Newfoundland's right above Nova Scotia 00:12.42 archpodnet Yeah I'd I'd buy it but anything that deals with the history channel on that show. It's like. 00:12.85 connor Yeah. 00:20.24 David Howe Let's ask the vice Princess Canadian Dusty shrombone. 00:25.20 archpodnet Um, what would your mouth. 00:27.92 David Howe He vice presidents Canadian Justie trumpone has been killed by trucks. 00:27.93 connor Let's check out Kyle Dun again steel Biden impression is is the best. Yeah yeah, but so the but thing with the island is that even if they did find something like good. 00:31.51 archpodnet Ah, all a guy my fellow jamaicans. Ah. 00:43.13 connor Right now like they've put themselves in that corner where there's pseudoscience. So like it's not easy to get out of it like like I've I've labeled them as such. Maybe it's just me being a dick but like you you kind of made you kind of made your bed now you shit in it or something whatever those. 00:45.24 archpodnet Yeah, right. 00:59.67 archpodnet I Know well you you you coined that term now you paid your bed you have to shit in it too. That was a conor that's a conor quote. No one says that yeah, you don't show your sleep. That's yeah you know Buts You don't shit where you eat that that's. 01:01.50 connor Is. 01:09.00 David Howe You know shit where you sleep. 01:10.63 connor So. 01:16.62 connor You you toilet shouldn't a toilet or in the woods. Okay. 01:16.69 David Howe Just because the green man can't see it doesn't mean you don't fear you man. 01:18.35 archpodnet That's the. 01:25.35 archpodnet I'm so mad that we that that vi that real got pulled of our inspiration if turning life and ruinse quotes into inspirational poems rd up because it had um, Carly they just. 01:34.18 David Howe Why to get pulled. 01:39.72 archpodnet Carly Ray Justin's song and that got flagged as copyright infringement. 01:41.78 David Howe She probably post a meme or two here and there I was we just need to take the old memes and turn them into reals and then make money off of it. 01:44.82 connor Um, yeah, you were you were you? both were um. 01:47.81 archpodnet We were doing good for a bit. Um, there were some gems out of that. But yeah, we need a new one. That's true. 01:57.12 connor Yeah. 02:00.14 David Howe Also archeology life is now a 15000 person followed page that just takes our memes or they take other archeology memes. Um. 02:07.22 archpodnet Yeah, no fuck those people I've been I've been ranting about those guys for a while because I went on try it like I messaged him like dude at least fucking credit us. 02:16.80 connor Yeah, this is um, the official stance of a life and room podcast Fuck you yeah you quit stealing our shit. 02:17.66 archpodnet Fuck that guy and particular. He's an archeology student too like he's out there if if you're at essays bro yeah quit fucking stealing a shit like Jesus. 02:29.60 David Howe Oh speaking of I will not be going to essays this year due to my ah feeble state and so we I will not be there as as promised Carlton you will be there though, right? Just want to get this. Ah okay. 02:38.36 archpodnet I have to be there I fly in Tuesday and I take a red eyee Friday because I have to run a pow. Wow saturday. 02:45.35 connor Yeah I won't be there either. You can see you can accurately describe a poww. Wow As a pow. Wow. 02:45.43 David Howe You said it on me. 02:47.37 archpodnet God Damn it god. 02:53.22 archpodnet Yeah, I'm actually running a powow That's that's not. 02:55.50 David Howe You just you just can't refer to like a meeting at work as a powwow right? is that the new thing I follow a few indigenous creators and they're like you can't say this you can't see that you can't see that and then the next day it's like reversing that so I just I literally just can't keep up. 03:00.67 archpodnet I Think so yeah, you can. 03:00.98 connor Yeah, that's yeah, that's I mean. 03:12.91 David Howe But I want to respect it. What's the stance on eskimo. 03:14.11 archpodnet Yeah, so so I. 03:14.24 connor Okay, so um, no I we're gonna do this. We're gonna do this properly. We're gonna do this properly shut the fuck up shut the fuck up. We're doing this properly What do natives think about this sort of perpetuation of vikings and things like that because we have this on the script. It. 03:21.11 David Howe Third. 03:34.30 archpodnet Oh yes, yes, yes, so actually I talked with me I talked with this with Matt um Reid maybe like a year ago so Matt Reed po nation Tippo you know because we're out of Oklahoma now. Um. 03:34.16 connor Ah, checks out. 03:47.26 archpodnet It's it's becoming problematic where it rears its ugly head a lot especially in lamb client land claims in Oklahoma where there are people that are like well vikings were here first and you know it goes back to that whole myth of well we were already here. So it's not native land. So no to my knowledge. I have never once heard an indigenous oral tradition which mentions vikings in Oklahoma or in the continental us a lot of things but pathfinder was a hell of a movie. 04:14.28 connor And they mention a lot of things they they pretty much just grab it describe everything. 04:22.43 David Howe It was carl urban man no room big deal. Ah question for the us and the audience just to ponder um with the vikings or the norwegians getting to the north I should say getting to North America and Greenland. 04:23.42 archpodnet Just. 04:23.44 connor Jesus oh man. 04:39.18 David Howe At the time they did would that not have spread diseases. Ah that could have then spread as well contributing to the decline of native populations before Columbus. 04:46.90 archpodnet I think the interactions were different I think that's why primarily like 1 new those northeastern canada was not as more isolated not as densely populated based on the evidence of of violence and like the small and. 04:54.75 David Howe More isolated up there. 05:05.60 archpodnet Ah, habitation like it. 05:07.20 David Howe Well, if you're getting Norwegian blood on your face after hitting them with a like a cell tax. You're gonna get some diseases from that or like that that is that is Bloodborne pathogens but ah to your point I don't know if they actually spread any yeah. 05:16.90 archpodnet Um, yeah i. Yeah yeah, either they're not I my knowledge of indigenous geography in Canada is especially Northeastern Canada is like really bad but um. Do know those though there was much more continuous and upfront contact and partying in hispaniola which was part of a much greater and immediate trade network and then the spanish stayed for a long time with much more people. Um, right? and. 05:46.56 David Howe That makes sense perfect. 05:47.28 connor So like the impact of like the vikings is like what 30 to maybe 150 people pop in there for 20 years and then get the fuck out like the that that that disease vector is very small. It seems like. 05:53.32 archpodnet Like yeah and then yeah and it and it looks like you know based on projectile points being embedded in viking skeletons like wasn't very great. Um, whereas the the initial interaction Hispaniola was. 06:06.33 connor Yes. 06:11.58 archpodnet Different and then the continued interaction in Mesoerica which was a hub of trade like that thing. That's when diseases really just kind of spread right? because yeah so honor. But. 06:19.26 connor But I'm not saying that I was going to say that it's not to say that that there wasn't disease passed along with them. But I just think that that the the effect on the larger community is probably smaller. 06:19.94 David Howe Gotcha Well I guess the norse might oh sorry. 06:26.14 archpodnet Yeah. Or shit or might have happened so long ago right? because we're talking about the eleventh century that there might have could absolutely have been but it was much more isolated case and we just won't see it as compared to what happened in you know the late fifteenth century and sixteenth century right? Like that was. 06:31.22 David Howe Yeah. 06:42.10 David Howe Um. 06:46.73 David Howe And they weren't living in cities as big as madrid in London and and Paris like to be having that much to like the vikings may not have had those diseases on them anyway, being isolated up in Northern Europe they but add something because they were in close contact with pigs and cows all the time. 06:55.92 archpodnet Right. 06:56.40 connor Yeah. 07:01.11 archpodnet A. 07:01.22 connor Oh yeah, yeah, they had something something nasty huh that's really interesting I mean you won yeah you wonder what? that impact is um in the larger scope of things like 20 years in an archeological sense is like nothing. 07:16.85 archpodnet Right? Yeah, that's that's a really good like disease vector question of like how do those pathogens spread you know because. 07:18.48 connor And in human interaction sense is real small. 07:28.60 David Howe Um, I think you're right like and meso Americaica It's just there's millions of people um to know Chit La was just done like there's there's no stop in that. Um. 07:30.77 archpodnet Yeah, yeah, yeah, no, and it it just moves so far off. 07:36.21 connor I Think the correct word is orgies. 07:40.36 David Howe Well if we want to get into Columbus's diary that's a little dicey. 07:43.60 connor Yeah, it's a little hairy. 07:45.35 archpodnet Not yeah Columbus was a fuck your first shit. Yeah. 07:49.34 David Howe Even the people with Columbus were like this guy is suss. 07:53.27 connor I. 07:53.99 archpodnet Yeah, like they were like convicts that came over like the like those early con key stores were just not good people even by European standards like they were just yeah. 08:03.85 David Howe Did you guys listen to my my episode last week ah account ah my friend and I were spitballing this the the Conk the conkister all came over as entrepreneurs like they weren't like soldiers really, they weren't like they're just businessmen. 08:06.55 connor Um, nope. 08:19.57 David Howe But also it's like a known thing that a lot of ceos and businessmen are sociopaths because they have that like cut through so like most of those people if that holds true coming over to the Americas were just sociopaths let loose with swords and germs just destroying North America 08:21.73 archpodnet Yeah, yeah. 08:30.83 archpodnet Yeah guns germs and so right and that and that that goes into that whole context like vikings were looking for land they wanted to be farmers and like if it's if it's gonna be difficult to farm. We're gonna fuck off like that's why they like left Newfoundland it was difficult to farm there like there's other places we can farm that are easier. 08:34.42 connor Ah. 08:46.91 David Howe Ah. 08:48.83 archpodnet Whereas like as David mentioned the conke stores were there to make money they were there to for gold and that was the end goal and they wanted that gold right? That's the same difference between the relationship with the french and the english and the spanish in the Americas is like the context in which they're colonizing the french were like we're here for natural resources and beavers and. 08:54.40 David Howe And land. Yeah, yeah. 09:07.86 archpodnet We're not staying and so they made like great relationships with the indigenous as trading. Partners were like the English did the same thing but once the Americans got all uppity and one of their own country then they're like well we want the rest this place as ours get rid of everyone else. 09:24.59 David Howe And they did. 09:25.63 archpodnet I think it's in the definition of independence like like King George the third is not allowing us to eradicate the indian savages like we want to move west of the Appalachia like it's verbatim in this country's like manifesto like us. 09:33.32 David Howe I. 09:37.62 connor Yeah. 09:40.73 archpodnet King George George the third to fuck off is we want to kill indians. 09:42.89 David Howe I Did I saw that too that like in the early expansive Wars with the tecumse and stuff like the British reciding with the indigenous being like hey we told them not to settle past the Appalachians If you don't want them to do that join with us. It's like. 09:56.75 archpodnet Yeah. 09:59.64 David Howe The Americans were like no, we're gonna get them just. 10:01.23 archpodnet They said they're going to the end zone being California like we're going all the way hundred yard line we're getting to the end zone now like it like and yeah North America history is just fucking crazy that was so I did like that episode David and I know we're totally off topic but I was like really thinking about how like Paw Ee Land was 10:09.22 David Howe Um, ah. 10:20.16 archpodnet Under New Spain and then New France and then America while also still being half in Spain for a while like our hunting territories were in Spain and then like yeah it was just like I was like really looking at I was like holy fuck like my ancestral territory has been under the influence of like 3 major. 10:26.47 David Howe Right? It's just what. 10:37.69 archpodnet Technically 4 major powers over the course of 500 years 10:39.50 David Howe Yeah, dude is wild and like all those early concrete explorers like walked up through like to like Arkansas from Florida you just don't think about freaking cabesa de voca walking through Nashville but he like did you know in full plate armor with malaria being like. 10:54.72 archpodnet Ah, and that's where they saw that's where he saw the Memphis pyramids that's where we saw the pyramids and in Memphis. 10:58.41 David Howe Word are the indigenous Don the done nothing and then henith I can't do a spanish accent in the henith. Ah, but um, anyway, yeah yeah yeah I thought that that stuff was fascinating but it's the same thing with the the viking stuff like. 11:06.82 connor In the head. 11:17.24 David Howe You just don't think about that globalism back then you know like just how small the world actually is in a way. Um. 11:26.62 archpodnet Yeah, and yeah and I think at the same time in the eleventh century. That's when polynesians were interacting with South America and had gotten to rappa newi. So like there's and ah, right? And while all this is going on there are inuit in Alaska trading with their cousins. The inuit. 11:32.11 David Howe Um, yeah. 11:43.72 archpodnet And Eastern Russia and like they have fucking venetian beads in Alaska at this part so like people are still connected like there's still way more going on. That's just not. We forget. It's like North and South America we're always connected into this world but like god forbid the spanish didn't know about it. 11:52.33 David Howe Um, yeah. 11:53.59 connor Um, yeah. 11:57.14 David Howe It just to them at that point without thinking about it in terms of cartography. It's like it's just the land that way. It's not like it's a new thing so when people say like Columbus didn't discover America I disagree I think like for the the most of european culture and like the enlightenment era. 12:02.92 archpodnet Yes, yes. 12:16.81 David Howe Like North America was discovered then because that's when people came in droves and they started mapping it out and stuff but like before that it was just like. 12:20.98 archpodnet I think the idea of like well I think the idea of like Christopher Clubbus didn't discover America because it'd already been technically discovered for 15000 years like I think it's a juxtaposition of like yes europeans were now made aware of it. But like. 12:34.79 David Howe Well yeah, like full on like annexed like I guess would be the word. 12:35.24 connor I think discovered is the wrong word. This number is definitely the wrong word word. It's like it's yeah, no, no I mean like um ah brought it brought like brought it to the minds of europeans. 12:36.50 archpodnet It would people were pretty there. Yeah discovers the wrong world. Yes. The world became global. Yeah I think the world became far more globalized at when Christopher Columbus brought it into the european worldview but it was still part of a global cult network. There people had been here interacting with their regional partners which were interacting with their other regional partners. So like there's steppings. 12:49.47 David Howe Yeah, right once they figured that out. 13:05.65 archpodnet Zones between North and South America already on a broad basis with europe so there was already a very long chain of interaction. However, the world became globalized once europeans central europeans right? because we've just established the the swedes already knew about this place. 13:06.35 David Howe Right. 13:22.62 David Howe Southern Europeans Yeah I would say but um. 13:23.64 archpodnet Yeah, so like Southern Western Europeans are like oh now it's part of but then there's a whole talk about the basque and the basque knowing about Cape cod. Yeah, there's a whole. There's a whole other. 13:30.60 David Howe Who cares I I. 13:32.36 connor Oh my God I'd get the film. 13:36.39 archpodnet Like of of and then like christopher club. His wife is basque and these bas fishermen are coming back with caught like there's a whole other like under current. Yeah, it's a book called caught. It's called caught who wrote it. 13:41.35 David Howe Ah I didn't know that but I want to I want to rephrase that so I don't sound like a white supremacist but like from what you were saying like the those siberians trading with the alaskans If you're thinking of like a map on sive. 13:58.40 connor On. 13:59.62 David Howe It's just the land a little bit that way with the cloud like the fog of war behind it and then if you're looking at Newfoundland it's a little bit past Greenland with a huge cloud behind it. They don't know anything else there Columbus what he did was go way to the middle of North America central america and be like there's some shit here and like then it expanded from there. Not to say that he didn't discover it for it because like he or he did discover it first. The other people technically discovered it. But I think that term is just throwing around to be like Columbus bad and it's like it. He was. 14:25.78 connor I mean he he forged the link but he yeah he forged the link between North America or and and Europe he created the potential for a link between those 2 I think that's a better way of putting it than like saying because discovery is a lot. 14:36.35 archpodnet Yes. 14:38.58 David Howe Um, yeah, it's a channel. 14:43.25 connor Late in work. Yeah, it's like it's like they now they own it because you discover something like that's that's not something that we want. 14:45.78 archpodnet Right. 14:48.21 David Howe Um, let's say he was the first to exploit it I'll take that deal. 14:53.76 connor Yeah, by then yeah I'll take that deal. 14:54.72 archpodnet I'd buy that. Yeah, just yeah I'll take that deal. That's a good deal. You take that deal Donny that's a good deal. So just so people know not crazy. It's called it's called cod a biography of the fish that changed the world by Mark. 15:02.90 connor Um. 15:02.29 David Howe I'd make that deal. 15:09.10 archpodnet Klansky and there's a great quote cod. It turns out is the reason europeans set sail across the Atlantic and as the only reason they could what did the vikings eat nice and Greenland and on the 5 expedition to America's record in the Iceland lilandic sagas cod frozen a dried and the frost year then broken to pieces and eat light heart attackck what was the staple of medieval diet cod again. Sold salted by the basques and enigmatic people with a mysterious unlimited supply of cod during the medieval warming period where the european fisheries were absolutely fucking destitute where they get that cod evidence points to cape cod. Yeah. 15:35.62 David Howe Hi. 15:41.43 David Howe Interesting. We talked about that in cultural class. 15:42.60 connor Interesting it. 15:45.56 archpodnet Is what his bra. It's a whole fucking thing like there's there's some things behind it like she might have known christopher been like I know something's over there. Did you caught up it or caught up into it that was great I like that I like that. 15:49.62 David Howe The globalists. 15:52.80 connor Yeah, they got caught up in it. Um, let's end this episode now where we yeah caught caught caught up into. Okay, yeah, yeah, where up before we go on another tangent. Let's end this episode. 15:54.56 David Howe Oh I think. 16:04.21 archpodnet You know it's There's a second book called Salt Guess what that one's about but yeah, kind of Conter's gonna assault me if I keep this fucking rant going. 16:07.38 connor Because we're like at 22 boys 16:10.82 David Howe Ah, salted cod. The salted cod is particularly good. 16:14.31 connor Assault Yeah, all right I like follow subscribe. Thank you for listening to us. Um, we got links in the show notes too. 16:22.23 archpodnet Um. 16:30.92 connor All the the things we referenced during this podcast which was like 2 things because we are terrible at finding sources but we are not wrong. Yeah. 16:38.46 David Howe No, but this was a fun discussion like I liked from the ones we had um I'll so I'll screenshot my tabs for you. Um, site sources guys. Please be sure to rate and review the podcast. Ah where these new formats are kind of fun. 16:40.10 archpodnet I Have a bunch of tabs like there a bunch of yeah Urls will throw them in there. 16:47.91 connor Um. 16:54.99 David Howe Ah, so just let us know what you're thinking comment I'll try to make a post on Instagram for you guys to comment on. Let us know what you think because I know people that follow the Instagram are the ones who do listen. Um, we do have the discord if you guys want to join that. Um, and yeah, just because sure to rate and review. 17:12.74 connor And with that we are out. 17:13.33 archpodnet And with that we're out. Do we have a joke. 17:17.82 David Howe Um, Rachel before the ah before the joke. Um, that can the part where I talk about indigenous and like the eskimo stuff. Can you cut that I didn't have time to like give that context at the end there. So let's let's just cut that out. So we're not you know, canceled on Twitter the whole then right and 3 2 1 connor. Ah, do you do have un chief stay see. 17:39.74 connor See this will send in um, by our lovely friend Jesse Tune so you guys have already seen this so act like it's funny. So why do astronauts use Apple products instead of Microsoft products. 17:50.87 archpodnet Um, oh that's. 17:54.95 David Howe It's not what you said. 17:56.45 connor Yeah, we can't say that on year because they can't open windows in space refer for for for for for for. 18:06.94 archpodnet Thank you and with that we are out. 18:08.10 David Howe Oof.